Le Mans (spoiler etc)

[pablo]

Kinda predictable at this stage, my take on it is...

1. Stoner continues to be *the* guy that clearly makes the most out of
the superior Honda package

2. Pedrosa whines on, it was *his* mistake standing up the bike and
ploughing into Simoncelli, who had passed him clean

3. Watch out, the Ducatis are getting better... but will they improve
fast enough to pose a challenge...?

4. If the Yamahas get weaker while the Ducatis get stronger... I guess
we'll know ho to credit with being the top bike developer... :D (hint:
it ain't Hayden :D)

[sturd]

Post by pablo
2. Pedrosa whines on, it was *his* mistake standing up the bike and
ploughing into Simoncelli, who had passed him clean

I didn't see that from the US coverage. Not a good enough angle.
Sure looked like Simo chopped off the midget from what I saw.
Couldn't be sure though. Race control thought so - thus the
ride through penalty. The on-bike from Pedrosa's bike sure
looked like the midget had the line but I think that view is even
less reliable than the other camera shots.

Post by pablo
3. Watch out, the Ducatis are getting better... but will they improve
fast enough to pose a challenge...?

Yeabut. The factory Hondas don't take each other out and
Ducati / Rossi don't look quite as good.

Post by pablo
4. If the Yamahas get weaker while the Ducatis get stronger... I guess
it ain't Hayden :D)

No surprise there, if it really happens.



Go fast. Take chances.
Mike S.

[Julian Bond]

Post by sturd

Post by pablo
2. Pedrosa whines on, it was *his* mistake standing up the bike and
ploughing into Simoncelli, who had passed him clean

I didn't see that from the US coverage. Not a good enough angle.
Sure looked like Simo chopped off the midget from what I saw.
Couldn't be sure though. Race control thought so - thus the
ride through penalty. The on-bike from Pedrosa's bike sure
looked like the midget had the line but I think that view is even
less reliable than the other camera shots.

This one will run and run. IMHO:-
- Simoncelli should have waited one more corner, and/or given Pedrosa
more room

- Pedrosa should have given up earlier. He was going to lose the place
no matter what. If not then, then 1 or 2 corners later.

- Pedrosa's braking was out of control. The back wheel was coming off
the ground. If he'd braked just a little harder, earlier and more under
control he could have made the corner in the 1.5 meters of tarmac that
Simoncelli left him. And then lost the place on the next corner as he
would then have been on the outside.

- So I think both riders were to blame, somewhat,

- But race control were right to penalise Simoncelli to encourage the
others and to force him and them to think a little before going for an
unlikely pass. It's not ballet, it is a contact sport, but it needs to
be clean and relatively safe for the global TV market. It apparently
takes a few raps on knuckles to remind them.

- There's been quite a few incidents lately that feel like they've been
born of arrogance. What Stoner so succinctly called "more ambition than
talent". Roughly, "I'm the great XXX. How dare this little shit get in
my way as I show just how great I am". I'd put Lorenzo on Simoncelli,
Lorenzo on Dovizioso in this. And I think this applies to Pedrosa's
attitude to being passed by Simoncelli. Pedrosa should know by now that
one place doesn't lose you the championship, but a crash and injury
certainly can. He didn't have to fight for that place and was going to
lose it shortly no matter what he did. He chose to fight back and paid
the price.

[les]

Post by Julian Bond
- But race control were right to penalise Simoncelli

complete and utter bo**ocks.
IMHO, of course

[pablo]

what is clear from observing the clips on motogp.com is that Pedrosa
would have not touched Simoncelli if he hadn't stood up his bike to
straighten his line. *that* is why they touched, and since it was
Pedrosa standing up the bike and basically making the decision to
touch Simoncelli with his own front wheel... it felt like a bizarre
decision to change line and to attack with one's front wheel... fact
is that i don't think Pedrosa has ever been good at tough infighting,
and -as Julian said- he picked a very questionable moment to get all
martial on the racetrack. Simoncelli was through, Pedorsa had lost
out, and it was up to him to concede. and either he didn't want to, or
he didn't know how to (and the latter is my guess, i think he has only
one way to lap a circuit and can't change the line even when it means
going down as in this case).

i do agree Simoncelli is a bit of a loose bullet and that there have
been too many questionable moves as of late, so maybe that's why they
are going for a smackdown, but i hope they are consistent in enforcing
it (Rossi definitely deserved it when he uselessly took down Stoner).

...p

[Julian Bond]

Post by les

Post by Julian Bond
- But race control were right to penalise Simoncelli

complete and utter bo**ocks.
IMHO, of course

2 sides to that. Should Simo have been punished? Should the punishment
have been something in the race like the ride through or left till
afterwards?

[Ed Light]

Dani had the right of way, being on the inside, and Simo barged in from
the outside, is how it looked to me. Rossi doesn't even think Simo
didn't goof.
--
Ed Light

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http://realnews.com

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[Champ]

On Sun, 15 May 2011 22:27:44 -0700 (PDT), pablo

Post by pablo
1. Stoner continues to be *the* guy that clearly makes the most out of
the superior Honda package

Yep, certainly seems that way.

Post by pablo
2. Pedrosa whines on, it was *his* mistake standing up the bike and
ploughing into Simoncelli, who had passed him clean

I think this one if very difficult to call. The footage we've seen is
certainly not conclusive, and I think the on-bike from Pedrosa is
particularly misleading.

I'm certainly open to the intepretation that Simo gave Pedrosa enough
room, but that Dani was riding a defensive line, ran out of brakes and
had to run wide. Right into Simo.

However, I definitely think that imposing a ride through penalty for
this wrong. It a decision that impacts the result and can't be
appealed. They should have let the race run, imposed a 30 second
(say) penalty on Simo, and then let his team appeal. Then all the
data can be analysed, including brake pressure on that and previous
laps.

Post by pablo
3. Watch out, the Ducatis are getting better... but will they improve
fast enough to pose a challenge...?

As Sturd pointed out, without the Pedrosa/Simoncelli incident, Rossi
would only have been 5th, which doesn't look so good.

Post by pablo
4. If the Yamahas get weaker while the Ducatis get stronger... I guess
it ain't Hayden :D)

heh

[Ed Light]

Rossi says:

http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/sport/sportresults/MotoGP/2011/May/may1611-rossi-blames-simoncelli/
--
Ed Light

Better World News TV Channel:
http://realnews.com

Iraq Veterans Against the War and Related:
http://ivaw.org
http://couragetoresist.org
http://antiwar.com

Send spam to the FTC at
***@uce.gov
Thanks, robots.

[Idea]

Post by Champ

Post by pablo
3. Watch out, the Ducatis are getting better... but will they improve
fast enough to pose a challenge...?

As Sturd pointed out, without the Pedrosa/Simoncelli incident, Rossi
would only have been 5th, which doesn't look so good.

Rossi still beat Lorenzo fair and square though and gave Dovi a good run for
his money, some might argue that Lorenzo was on his number two bike, but if
you cant adjust ... then thats all part of racing too, its not always going
to be perfect for any rider.

I predict more podiums for Rossi this year and certainly dont rule out a win
or two ... same go's for Simonceli, Lorenzo is right to be worried there.

We need more *racers* like Rossi and Simo and less *prima donna* attitudes
like Stoner and Lorenzo IMHO.

Bring it on.

[Champ]

Post by Idea
I predict more podiums for Rossi this year and certainly dont rule out a win
or two ... same go's for Simonceli, Lorenzo is right to be worried there.

I think a win is definitely on the cards for Simo. Rossi should get
more podiums, but I don't know if he and Ducati are going to be able
to improve the bike enough to challenge for the win. He was 15
seconds or so behind Stoner on Sunday - that's a lot to find.

Post by Idea
We need more *racers* like Rossi and Simo and less *prima donna* attitudes
like Stoner and Lorenzo IMHO.

I tend to agree with this.

I'm not quite sure why Simoncelli has been singled out for such
criticism this year - it seems to be a case of "give a dog a bad name"
to me. Sure he's forceful and aggresive, but certainly no worse than
Rossi has been, and Lorenzon's move on Dovi at Le Mans was worse than
anything I've seen Simo do.

[sturd]

Post by Champ
I'm not quite sure why Simoncelli has been singled out for such
criticism this year

It's the fro.

Simo's a racer no doubt. I like that a lot.

Schwantz's read is Pedrosa shoulda let Simo go. Not sure
I agree with that but interesting angle:
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2011/May/11051734x34=lemans.htm


Go fast. Take chances.
Mike S.